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Re: Mexican localization

by
Andi Becker
- 10/19/2016 10:27:10
Sorry Fabien but that is wrong!

And it is completely customer unfriendly what you just posted here!

Also we here in Thailand have to keep data for 5 some for 10 years. This data is until now in smaller companies often in print so it won't be much of an issue but if you have bigger companies they keep it in digital forms and they really need to be able to access the data and view the data.

Therefore at least the all localization structures should also be available in community edition. 

"The whole eco-system / business model of Odoo relies on extra features in Odoo Enterprise that are not in Odoo Community. And this model allows us to finance both the evolution of Enterprise and Community editions. So, it's a good thing."


That exactly is not the case as long as this localization structure is not available in both versions.

"if you don't pay for your software, you can not use it anymore. (but you still own your own data through an open format: PostgreSQL)"


This is also completely wrong as even I don't pay anymore for my WORD or EXCEL or whats however License I still can access my data with the Version it has been stored. This is not the case with Odoo S.A. and it is not possible with Enterprise version as you lock down the access but it is still possible at any time with the community edition!

Actually ONLY with the community edition. Here customers can actually keep complete backups of files, stored database data and also the current complete modules and Odoo System. Which means if they have to check something during those 5 years they still can setup the system in more or less no time i.e. if dockerized and do and check what they need to do. This is nt possible with your SaaS or Enterprise version! Customers are simply lost with it in translation I would say.

Did you ever tried to access a postgres DB wich contains Odoo data without Odoo as you won't get the community Version up and running and than do calculations, checks or find even the related files. Oh my god this is incredible ignorant of basic legal business requirements I would say even in Belgium. 

What you just posted means nothing else that you force customers into your Enterprise or SAAS model of you will throw them back into Stoneage with the remark "Help your self, you have the data."

Have you ever checked how i.e. SAP and other ERP provider are handling that legal issue? I guess not!

This is also completely wrong as even I don't pay anymore for my WORD or EXCEL or whats however License I still can access my data with the Version it has been stored. This is not the case with Odoo S.A. and it is not possible with Enterprise version as you lock down the access but it is still possible at any time with the community edition!

Actually ONLY with the community edition. Here customers can actually keep complete backups of files, stored database data and also the current complete modules and Odoo System. Which means if they have to check something during those 5 years they still can setup the system in more or less no time i.e. if dockerized and do and check what they need to do. This is nt possible with your SaaS or Enterprise version! Customers are simply lost with it in translation I would say.

Did you ever tried to access a postgres DB wich contains Odoo data without Odoo as you won't get the community Version up and running and than do calculations, checks or find even the related files. Oh my god this is incredible ignorant of basic legal business requirements I would say even in Belgium.

What you just posted means nothing else that you force customers into your Enterprise or SAAS model of you will throw them back into Stoneage with the remark "Help your self, you have the data."

Have you ever checked how i.e. SAP and other ERP provider are handling that legal issue? I guess not!

"Having a path to keep using the Enterprise features without having to pay for it (e.g. putting these features in Odoo Community, directly or through third party apps) is a non sense and would kill the sustainability of Odoo (as a company and product) in the long term"

This is actually the nonsense what you write here! Odoo won't even be in the position without the community surrounding it, have you ever realized that? Cutting of a way that people will be able to use their features in Community Edition what they had before in SaaS or Enterprise Edition is nothing else than a dictatorship and vendor login. ala Eat or Die! Friss oder Stirb!

There is not even existing an ECO System if it isn't possible for customers to reuse their data without handicap.

If that whole business model of Odoo S.A, relies on it that it is simply not well planned and need to be adjusted so that it meats basic legal requirements. You really can't argue that it is not an issue. Nearly everywhere in the world the proclaim meanwhile the digital countries - so also here Digital Thailand, Smart Cities etc. Nearly everything here gets digitalized in future and needs to be available and accessible in digital form also in future for those who want to see something you have done in your company 5 years ago or even longer in some countries. So please don't argue with the view of a Man living in the past and open your eyes for the future.

If people should use Odoo 10 and future versions they invest in it not oly a lot of money but also perhaps a much bigger effort to get all their data in and working and you say that if they decide to switch to the community edition after they realized that the Enterprise Edition is not worth the money as they won't using all these features or because they need additional adjustments and don't rely on Enterprise features and than after ending they won't be able to run their stuff again is pretty ignorant of basic business needs.

The solution on the other hand is quite simple, you only would need to provide and guarantee that the customers will be able to use the latest version even they have no more paid for an upgrade! This is actually what most companies are doing. They don't do vendor login they simply provide normal access. 

So please be a bit more realistic and release what is needed to get the sites up and running again - but without those upgrades which came after the payment stopped, or make it available for community version which on the other hand would be also very beneficial for Odoo S.A. again as many more people would again start contributing to it!


On Wed, Oct 19, 2016 at 8:57 PM, Fabien Pinckaers <fp@odoo.com> wrote:

But companies are legally required to keep their records for periods that can vary from 5 to 10 years, sometimes more. 

The above makes it ERP SaaS not a viable option for most businesses.

That's what you say but it's not our feedback from the market. (in terms of customers feedback & sales figures)
 
Whether you use Odoo Enterprise or Odoo Online, you always have access to your data through PostgreSQL. It's not an issue. I don't think we have lost a single customer based on that assumption (we have 4000+ customers). It's a common practice in the industry: if you don't pay for your software, you can not use it anymore. (but you still own your own data through an open format: PostgreSQL)

With Odoo Online, you can download your DB at any time and access with PSQL, on Odoo Enterprise or keep a 1-user DB and desactivate all others user to access through the enterprise UI if you prefer.


The whole eco-system / business model of Odoo relies on extra features in Odoo Enterprise that are not in Odoo Community. And this model allows us to finance both the evolution of Enterprise and Community editions. So, it's a good thing.

Having a path to keep using the Enterprise features without having to pay for it (e.g. putting these features in Odoo Community, directly or through third party apps) is a non sense and would kill the sustainability of Odoo (as a company and product) in the long term. It's a good thing to have features in Odoo Enterprise that are not in Odoo Community.



-- 
Fabien

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