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Re: Runbot / Staging - argument's against madness

by
dar
- 01/02/2015 19:46:55
​I agree, let's re-subject about a [PLACHOLDER CI], which is opensource and easy to use with git.​

Then about a [PLACEHOLDER STAGING] solution, which is open source and easy to use with [PLACEHOLDER CI].
Just one out of many: https://teatro.io/ - not opens rouce thoug...

But then if we erranuously shortlink the [PLACEHOLDER CI] to save investigation effort, just because it is so widely trustet (kinda leap frog own investigation for the sake of agility - actually we are already going in the right direction in this particular aspect of placeholder ci), there is this downside, that travis dosen't ship a staging.

And there is an upside, that this opens a new perspective: Modern Dev-prod-parity! Travis has a Deis connector (which follows actually heroku's git push workflow) and builts staging docker containers for you, this is just cool and exciting :) 

But makes sense, too - because, let's predict a bit the future: in 2 - 5 years time, also in Odoo, all types of bootup scripts / builtout receipts /chefs / puppets / ansibles /cookbooks, etc will just be gone away. A staging image, if it passes, becomes production image. This will be accomplished by the Deis wokflow on top of CoreOS/fleet and later on (when odoo eventually taps this famous mass market) mesos/marathon. Rember the benefits of dev-prod-parity (http://12factor.net/dev-prod-parity).

Se we can wait ... or act. At least with the above prediction, there is a little bit of predictibility in the game - just kidding. :D but I did some research on it for the better part of the last two days (with the right mindest, that's enough, trust me!) and strategically evaluated coreos/fleet against mesos/marathon, deis agains flynn, against mesosphere against atlas (hashicorp), against openstack vs cloudstack (those last two ones are out of the game already). I've analyzed Docker Composer / Swarm / Machine announcements and it's probable impact on the whole ecosystem. I tried to analyze speaker to get an idea of how their repsective projects tick internally, and if this internal mindset is future proof. CEO's say a lot about their future ;-) - As a sidenote: it's relaxes me to know that Odoo is making efforts in the right direction.

If you look at the history of mesos, there are touching points with google borg peolpe - borg beeing one of the better kept secrets of googles infrastructure for almost a decade. Google has already launched kypernetes in their clusters, they have an astonishingly intersting commitment to the docker community. Why all this?

Because, there are some people out there, who shape the future, we should read them. ;)

A talk, I really liked... In medias res! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnIsmNN1sVA

Hope I could transmit some of my mindshare and -set.

So anyone capable of a proof of concept with travis and Deis on CoreOS on a local VM? Come on guys, this is something exciting :) - I'm unfortunately not shipped with the technical knowledge which could follow suit conceptual understanding.

Saludos Cordiales
David Arnold

David Arnold BA HSG / Analista
315 304 13 68/ dar@devco.co

devCO - empresa de consultoría de sistemas (en fundación)
http://www.devco.co

This e-mail message may contain confidential or legally privileged information and is intended only for the use of the intended recipient(s). Any unauthorized disclosure, dissemination, distribution, copying or the taking of any action in reliance on the information herein is prohibited. E-mails are not secure and cannot be guaranteed to be error free as they can be intercepted, amended, or contain viruses. Anyone who communicates with us by e-mail is deemed to have accepted these risks. devCO is not responsible for errors or omissions in this message and denies any responsibility for any damage arising from the use of e-mail. Any opinion and other statement contained in this message and any attachment are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the company.


2015-01-02 18:52 GMT-05:00 Bevan Weiss <kaizen__@hotmail.com>:

Why pick Travis though?

Why not Atlassian CI, or Drone, or…..

There is currently a ‘workable’ solution which is the Odoo Runbot.

Yes, perhaps there are other improvements that could be made, I do like the idea of having Odoo CI containerised… this way it becomes much easier to test a particular commit of Odoo against more than just one version of Postgres, or one browser, or one wkhtmltopdf version etc etc.

 

I think more diligence is required with the current system though (just as it would be with any other system).

 

 

Bevan

 

From: David Arnold [mailto:dar@devco.co]
Sent: Saturday, 3 January 2015 9:58 AM
To: Community
Subject: Re: Runbot / Staging - argument's against madness

 

Hi Bevan

 

I'm really glad for this question, as it points out a broader problem of the odoo ecosystem thinking.

 

And I would counter your question with the following:

What are the costs of not keeping pace with innovation?

 

As to your question, I would feel comfortable about responding and adhering to a general hermeneutic:

If a bunch of people do nothing else, than finding ways to improve CI for the teck flocks out there, and they earn their money with exactly this, chances are positive, that they end up to have a superior solution. Details are really too complex to discuss about without loosing focus ;) - but to name one: it is replicable for community development, with minimal overhead (register a travis token, that's all it needs) and another one is: probably programmers, that learned programming in university and not throughout the new odoo-api-dcumentaion might be very well feel quite comfortable to see tools like travis, instead of having to learn YET ANOTHER X :) - so the point here is talent attraction... you can ever go further down the line, and find as many arguments as you might want, runbot is going to loose almost in every single dispute point.

 

So what's the point of keeping it? I mean really...

 

We all know, that the Odoo world has a strong NIH problem, which probably is due to a lot of functional people which got in touch with programming through the odoo window (actually I'm such a case), but seeing that this is strategically bad is the first step in order to cure :)

 

Best

 

David


Saludos Cordiales

David Arnold

David Arnold BA HSG / Analista
315 304 13 68/ dar@devco.co

devCO - empresa de consultoría de sistemas (en fundación)
http://www.devco.co

This e-mail message may contain confidential or legally privileged information and is intended only for the use of the intended recipient(s). Any unauthorized disclosure, dissemination, distribution, copying or the taking of any action in reliance on the information herein is prohibited. E-mails are not secure and cannot be guaranteed to be error free as they can be intercepted, amended, or contain viruses. Anyone who communicates with us by e-mail is deemed to have accepted these risks. devCO is not responsible for errors or omissions in this message and denies any responsibility for any damage arising from the use of e-mail. Any opinion and other statement contained in this message and any attachment are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the company.

 

2015-01-02 3:02 GMT-05:00 Bevan Weiss <kaizen__@hotmail.com>:

What are the benefits over the Runbot setup that Odoo currently has?

 

I think that the Runbot system just needs to be used better.  Lots of commits seem to hit the master which break the builds (according to Runbot).

This should never happen.

 

 

Bevan

 

From: David Arnold [mailto:dar@devco.co]
Sent: Friday, 2 January 2015 6:13 PM
To: Community
Subject: Runbot / Staging - argument's against madness

 

Hi Guys

 

Why Odoo doesn't rely on travis and simply pipe successfull runs to a staging server, like outlined here: http://docs.travis-ci.com/user/deployment/custom/

 

No, security is not the issue: http://docs.travis-ci.com/user/encryption-keys/

 

Deis (OpenSoruce PaaS), which could receive the travis pushes could even reside on your private laptop's CoreOS-VM: http://deis.io/overview/

(By the way, bite the bullet, it's coming anyway: DOCKER !!!)

 

Decide yourself:

- spending resources on maintaining code + configuration vs configuration-only

- using standard tools, versus writing documentation for self invented tools

- put the many arguments zipping through your head right now HERE.

 

Anyone capable of a proof-of-concept (probably with Deis on CoreOS-VM)? http://docs.travis-ci.com/user/deployment/deis/

Saludos Cordiales

David Arnold

David Arnold BA HSG / Analista
315 304 13 68/ dar@devco.co

devCO - empresa de consultoría de sistemas (en fundación)
http://www.devco.co

This e-mail message may contain confidential or legally privileged information and is intended only for the use of the intended recipient(s). Any unauthorized disclosure, dissemination, distribution, copying or the taking of any action in reliance on the information herein is prohibited. E-mails are not secure and cannot be guaranteed to be error free as they can be intercepted, amended, or contain viruses. Anyone who communicates with us by e-mail is deemed to have accepted these risks. devCO is not responsible for errors or omissions in this message and denies any responsibility for any damage arising from the use of e-mail. Any opinion and other statement contained in this message and any attachment are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the company.

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